I have been thinking about adding the ability to import and export text
files using the CTRL+A codes to Cobalt (my own ANSI art program). However,
I am not even sure where to begin.

1) What is the file format called?
2) Is it just exclusive to Synchronet?
3) Is there a specs document available?
4) If possible, where can I find a viewer?
5) Would this feature be something a SysOp would be interested in?

The reason why this came up is because I tried to set up my own BBS using Synchronet, but when I was poking around the files to see if I can start customizing it, I noticed that the files for some of the screens where
using the CTRL+A codes. The issue is that PabloDraw doesn't support it,
so I wouldn't know if Cobalt would export it correctly or not.

Thoughts?

-jag
Code it, Script it, Automate it!

... Fear not! I know how to write a "Hello, World!" program!
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.51
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Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Jagossel to All on Tue Jan 08 2019 08:14:00

I have been thinking about adding the ability to import and export text files using the CTRL+A codes to Cobalt (my own ANSI art program). However,

1) What is the file format called?

They're typically saved as .asc or .msg files, but I don't think there's a special name for the format.

2) Is it just exclusive to Synchronet?

I can't remember seeing them anywhere else; maybe someone else has.

3) Is there a specs document available?

http://wiki.synchro.net/custom:ctrl-a_codes

4) If possible, where can I find a viewer?

I doubt if there is one, apart from just displaying the file on a Synchronet BBS. In Javascript that'd be something like:

console.clear(7);
console.printfile('/path/to/file');
console.pause();

5) Would this feature be something a SysOp would be interested in?

We already have the ans2asc and asc2ans utilities included with Synchronet. Someone might want this since it would save them a conversion step.

---
echicken
electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com - 416-425-5435
■ Synchronet ■ electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: echicken to Jagossel on Tue Jan 08 2019 10:30 am

4) If possible, where can I find a viewer?

I doubt if there is one, apart from just displaying the file on a Synchronet BBS. In Javascript that'd be something like:

console.clear(7);
console.printfile('/path/to/file');
console.pause();

In the Windows Synchronet control panel, there's also the "Preview File" feature which can display files with Ctrl-A codes on the BBS machine.

5) Would this feature be something a SysOp would be interested in?

We already have the ans2asc and asc2ans utilities included with Synchronet. Someone might want this since it would save them a conversion step.

I believe there is/was also an editor for the Ctrl-A format in development included with Synchronet (or maybe downloadable separately?), but I remember reading that it still wasn't in a complete or good working state.. ans2asc and asc2ans is probably still a better option right now.

I wouldn't mind having an editor that could save directly to Ctrl-A format. But for now, using ans2asc to convert ANSI to Ctrl-A works okay.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Jagossel to All on Tue Jan 08 2019 08:14 am

The reason why this came up is because I tried to set up my own BBS using Synchronet, but when I was poking around the files to see if I can start customizing it, I noticed that the files for some of the screens where using the CTRL+A codes. The issue is that PabloDraw doesn't support it,
so I wouldn't know if Cobalt would export it correctly or not.

you can convert it back to ansi with a utility. it's a simple format and any editor could be modified to support the ctrl +a code format.

i prefer to use ansi
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Jagossel to All on Tue Jan 08 2019 08:14 am

customizing it, I noticed that the files for some of the screens where using the CTRL+A codes. The issue is that PabloDraw doesn't support it,

Yes it does. You have to open the file in Pablodraw by going to File->Open Then in the bottom right above the "Open" and "Cancel" buttons is dropdown box. Select "Ctrl-A (*.msg;*.asc)" and PabloDraw will open the file.

The same goes for saving the file, File->Save As... and select "Ctrl-A" from the "Save as type" field.

Certain special Ctrl-A codes aren't handled in PabloDraw, but all the color ones are.

DaiTengu

... Real Programmers do List Processing in FORTRAN.

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Jagossel to All on Tue Jan 08 2019 08:14 am

I have been thinking about adding the ability to import and export text files using the CTRL+A codes to Cobalt (my own ANSI art program). However,
I am not even sure where to begin.

1) What is the file format called?

Synchronet Ctrl-A format, I guess.

2) Is it just exclusive to Synchronet?

That I know of.

3) Is there a specs document available?

Sure, several by now. http://synchro.net/docs/customization.html#MessageColorCodes http://wiki.synchro.net/custom:ctrl-a_codes (latest most accurate)

4) If possible, where can I find a viewer?

SyncDraw, PabloDraw, and asc2ans would be good starters.

5) Would this feature be something a SysOp would be interested in?

We could also use more/better ANSI/block art generators!

The reason why this came up is because I tried to set up my own BBS using Synchronet, but when I was poking around the files to see if I can start customizing it, I noticed that the files for some of the screens where
using the CTRL+A codes. The issue is that PabloDraw doesn't support it,
so I wouldn't know if Cobalt would export it correctly or not.

PabloDraw *does* support the Synchronet Ctrl-A format.

digital man

This Is Spinal Tap quote #9:
David St. Hubbins: I mean, it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel.
Norco, CA WX: 51.6°F, 75.0% humidity, 0 mph SSW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs

---
■ Synchronet ■ Vertrauen ■ Home of Synchronet ■ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Nightfox to echicken on Tue Jan 08 2019 10:02 am

I wouldn't mind having an editor that could save directly to Ctrl-A format. But for now, using ans2asc to convert ANSI to Ctrl-A works okay.

PabloDraw can do that.

digital man

This Is Spinal Tap quote #7:
Nigel Tufnel: That's just nitpicking, isn't it?
Norco, CA WX: 51.6°F, 75.0% humidity, 0 mph SSW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs

---
■ Synchronet ■ Vertrauen ■ Home of Synchronet ■ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net

DaiTengu, to Jagossel...

customizing it, I noticed that the files for some of the screens where using the CTRL+A codes. The issue is that PabloDraw doesn't support it,

Yes it does. You have to open the file in Pablodraw by going to File->Open Then in the bottom right above the "Open" and "Cancel"
buttons is dropdown box. Select "Ctrl-A (*.msg;*.asc)" and PabloDraw
will open the file.

The same goes for saving the file, File->Save As... and select
"Ctrl-A" from the "Save as type" field.

Certain special Ctrl-A codes aren't handled in PabloDraw, but all the color ones are.

I did not look deep enough. Thanks for letting me know! I will have to take
a look again.

-jag
Code it, Script it, Automate it!

... User error: asleep at keyboard. Press F1 to continue.
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.51
■ Synchronet ■ the Outwest BBS - outwestbbs.com - Email denn@outwestbbs.com

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Jan 09 2019 02:08 am

I wouldn't mind having an editor that could save directly to Ctrl-A
format. But for now, using ans2asc to convert ANSI to Ctrl-A works
okay.

PabloDraw can do that.

I've heard PabloDraw supports Ctrl-A codes. I've used PabloDraw in the past to save ANSI screens but I seem to remember having issues with its screens sometimes, but I'll have to see how well PabloDraw's Ctrl-A files work.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Digital Man to Jagossel on Wed Jan 09 2019 02:08 am

4) If possible, where can I find a viewer?

SyncDraw, PabloDraw, and asc2ans would be good starters.

asc2ans is more of a converter though, isn't it? You still need a separate app to view the ANSI file after it's converted via asc2ans.

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Jagossel to DaiTengu on Wed Jan 09 2019 08:10 am

I did not look deep enough. Thanks for letting me know! I will have to take a look again.

Sure, no problem. It took me googling for an ANSI program that "read" ctrl-A and constant links to PabloDraw before I finally started digging into it. I knew it could save, but never knew it could actually display it.

DaiTengu

... Gossip is when you hear something you like about someone you don't.

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Wed Jan 09 2019 10:05 am

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Digital Man to Jagossel on Wed Jan 09 2019 02:08 am

4) If possible, where can I find a viewer?

SyncDraw, PabloDraw, and asc2ans would be good starters.

asc2ans is more of a converter though, isn't it? You still need a separate app to view the ANSI file after it's converted via asc2ans.

No, not really. If your terminal's stdout supports ANSI, then just running "asc2ans" will display the ANSI on the terminal.

digital man

This Is Spinal Tap quote #28:
We've got Armadillos in our trousers. It's really quite frightening.
Norco, CA WX: 57.6°F, 80.0% humidity, 6 mph NE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs

---
■ Synchronet ■ Vertrauen ■ Home of Synchronet ■ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Jan 09 2019 05:53 pm

asc2ans is more of a converter though, isn't it? You still need a
separate app to view the ANSI file after it's converted via asc2ans.

No, not really. If your terminal's stdout supports ANSI, then just running "asc2ans" will display the ANSI on the terminal.

Ah, I didn't know that. Omitting the .ans filename will cause it to output the ANSI on the terminal..

Nightfox

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Wed Jan 09 2019 08:19 pm

Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Jan 09 2019 05:53 pm

asc2ans is more of a converter though, isn't it? You still need a
separate app to view the ANSI file after it's converted via asc2ans.

No, not really. If your terminal's stdout supports ANSI, then just running "asc2ans" will display the ANSI on the terminal.

Ah, I didn't know that. Omitting the .ans filename will cause it to output the ANSI on the terminal..

Yup. And that used to great back in the DOS and even Win95 days and I just committed a patch to asc2ans.c to make it work on Windows 10 again.

digital man

This Is Spinal Tap quote #1:
Nigel Tufnel: These go to eleven.
Norco, CA WX: 54.6°F, 76.0% humidity, 0 mph SW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs

---
■ Synchronet ■ Vertrauen ■ Home of Synchronet ■ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net

On 01-09-19 12:10, DaiTengu wrote to Jagossel <=-

@VIA: VERT/ENSEMBLE
Re: Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Jagossel to DaiTengu on Wed Jan 09 2019 08:10 am

I did not look deep enough. Thanks for letting me know! I will have to take a look again.

Sure, no problem. It took me googling for an ANSI program that "read" ctrl-A and constant links to PabloDraw before I finally started digging into it. I knew it could save, but never knew it could actually display it.

Looks like I must take a look at PabloDraw to edit my menus. I have a couple of "silent" menu items, until I sort out the .ASC files. :)


... Bots are digital Minions!
--- MultiMail/Win v0.51
■ Synchronet ■ Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au

Re: Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Vk3jed to DaiTengu on Thu Jan 10 2019 02:42 pm

On 01-09-19 12:10, DaiTengu wrote to Jagossel <=-

@VIA: VERT/ENSEMBLE
Re: Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Jagossel to DaiTengu on Wed Jan 09 2019 08:10 am

I did not look deep enough. Thanks for letting me know! I will have to take a look again.

Sure, no problem. It took me googling for an ANSI program that "read" ctrl-A and constant links to PabloDraw before I finally started digging into it. I knew it could save, but never knew it could actually display it.

Looks like I must take a look at PabloDraw to edit my menus. I have a couple of "silent" menu items, until I sort out the .ASC files. :)

Couple of things:
PabloDraw automatically recognizes .msg files as being in Synchronet format, but when opening .asc files (with PabloDraw) you have to specifically tell it to open in Synchronet format.

v3.17b, Synchronet now supports .msg menu files, so more and more menu files are likely to be changed/renamed to *.msg. There is a slight difference in when a .msg versus .asc file will be shown to a user, but for more cases, they're functionally the same:
http://wiki.synchro.net/custom:menu_files

digital man

Synchronet "Real Fact" #56:
Synchronet Terminal Server introduced SecureShell (SSH) support w/v3.14a (2006).
Norco, CA WX: 49.7°F, 87.0% humidity, 0 mph SSE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs

---
■ Synchronet ■ Vertrauen ■ Home of Synchronet ■ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net

Re: Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Vk3jed to DaiTengu on Thu Jan 10 2019 02:42 pm

Looks like I must take a look at PabloDraw to edit my menus. I have a couple of "silent" menu items, until I sort out the .ASC files. :)

I re-did my menus a few weeks back using PabloDraw, I'm having a heck of a time trying to fit everything in. The Default Sync classic menu has no room for any extra commands :(

I go back and forth between wanting to create an entirely new menuset from scratch, and just modifying the default one, because that's what people are familiar with.

I think I'm going to settle on splitting off the message area stuff to its own menu at some point, but using all the same commands.

Ultimately I'd love to do a lightbar style menu, but I'm absolutely rubbish at design and User Interfaces.

DaiTengu

... Ebius tagline. This is a moebius tagline. This is a mo ...

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: DaiTengu to Vk3jed on Thu Jan 10 2019 12:43 pm

I re-did my menus a few weeks back using PabloDraw, I'm having a heck of a time trying to fit everything in. The Default Sync classic menu has no room for any extra commands :(

I go back and forth between wanting to create an entirely new menuset from scratch, and just modifying the default one, because that's what people are familiar with.

I don't think it matters if people are familiar with a particular BBS package's menu design. In fact, I think you definitely should customize your BBS's menus, since that helps make your BBS unique. The way I see it is that the default menus are an example of what the BBS package can do, and it's up to you to customize it to your liking. Leaving the stock menus means it will look just like every other stock Synchronet BBS, which is not really interesting.. It's good to see something different and unique.

Back in the 90s, at least with other BBS software, I always thought customizing the menus was necessary anyway. Other BBS packages I used didn't have an internal configured list of doors like Synchronet does, so it was necessary to customize your menus to add commands to run the various doors you wanted to set up for your BBS. So it was always natural to me to customize the menus, and not use the stock menus.

With Synchronet, the stock menus are not really how I envisioned my BBS to be laid out anyway. When I brought up my current BBS in 2007, I wanted my menus to operate and look similar to how I had my BBS menus in my original BBS in the 90s, so I created my own command shell and menu ANSIs for Synchronet. Initially I was able to re-use many of the ANSIs I had from my 90s BBS, modified a bit for use with my Synchronet command shell.

Ultimately I'd love to do a lightbar style menu, but I'm absolutely rubbish at design and User Interfaces.

There is a lightbar shell included with Synchronet - See lbshell.js (and its wrapper, lbshell.src, which is a Baja script that just runs the .js shell).

Nightfox

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■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

On 01-10-19 01:04, Digital Man wrote to Vk3jed <=-

Couple of things:
PabloDraw automatically recognizes .msg files as being in Synchronet format, but when opening .asc files (with PabloDraw) you have to specifically tell it to open in Synchronet format.

v3.17b, Synchronet now supports .msg menu files, so more and more menu files are likely to be changed/renamed to *.msg. There is a slight difference in when a .msg versus .asc file will be shown to a user, but for more cases, they're functionally the same: http://wiki.synchro.net/custom:menu_files

OK cool, thanks for the tips. :) I still have to upgrade to 3.17b. Should do it now while I have fairly current backups, though it will likely have to wait a week or so, because I can't do it in hot weather.


... If it's not on fire, then it's a software problem.
--- MultiMail/Win v0.51
■ Synchronet ■ Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au

On 01-10-19 12:43, DaiTengu wrote to Vk3jed <=-

I re-did my menus a few weeks back using PabloDraw, I'm having a heck
of a time trying to fit everything in. The Default Sync classic menu
has no room for any extra commands :(

Yes, it is a busy menu!

I think I'm going to settle on splitting off the message area stuff to
its own menu at some point, but using all the same commands.

That's not a bad idea, and is common to a lot of other BBS systems.

Ultimately I'd love to do a lightbar style menu, but I'm absolutely rubbish at design and User Interfaces.

I hate working with user interfaces. As for lightbar menus, I have a mixed feeling about them, and sit on the fence there. :)


... Dachshund kennel ad: Get a long little doggie.
--- MultiMail/Win v0.51
■ Synchronet ■ Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au

Re: Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: Nightfox to DaiTengu on Thu Jan 10 2019 02:16 pm

I don't think it matters if people are familiar with a particular BBS package's menu design. In fact, I think you definitely should customize your BBS's menus, since that helps make your BBS unique. The way I see it is that the default menus are an example of what the BBS package can do, and it's up to you to customize it to your liking. Leaving the stock menus means it will look just like every other stock Synchronet BBS, which is not really interesting.. It's good to see something different and unique.

I basically re-skinned the default sync menus, It gives my board enough of a "unique" flair to be memorable, but all the commands are still the same.

I also allow all the menusets sync has installed to be used by anyone. I'm all for customization. Let the user decide what they want, I'm not going to force my Bad ANSI on them.

Back in the 90s, at least with other BBS software, I always thought customizing the menus was necessary anyway. Other BBS packages I used didn't have an internal configured list of doors like Synchronet does, so it was necessary to customize your menus to add commands to run the various doors you wanted to set up for your BBS. So it was always natural to me to customize the menus, and not use the stock menus.

Oh, yeah. I've run loads of different BBS software. Proboard, PCBoard, Oblivion/2, Vision-X, RA, Searchlight, MajorBBS/worldgroup, even Excalibur
(and a bunch of others I set up and played with). I miss messing with all of them, but I love all the features Synchronet has. That's why the last time I set this back up (a few years ago), I briefly considered Mystic, along with another not-quite-finished BBS software written in nodejs called ENiGMA1/2, but I came right back to Synchronet because it has everything I wanted, and if I ever got bit by the bug, I could customize it (which I started doing over the last month).

I always edited my menus, but they were always pretty basic. Occasionally I could get a good looking design from an ANSI pack and edit it from there, but that still wasn't "unique".

There is a lightbar shell included with Synchronet - See lbshell.js (and its wrapper, lbshell.src, which is a Baja script that just runs the .js shell).

Yeah, I've used it. Deuce did a great job with it, but it's not my cup of tea. I want to say echicken's board has something closer to what I'd like, with a menu selection on the left, which brings up sub-menus on the right.

Someday.. maybe. I probably have the knowledge to do it now, or can figure it out by looking at other people's work, but I'm not sure I quite have the ambition yet.

DaiTengu

... I photocopied a mirror. Now I have an extra photocopy machine.

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: Re: CTRL+A Codes for SBBS
By: DaiTengu to Nightfox on Fri Jan 11 2019 01:12 pm

I basically re-skinned the default sync menus, It gives my board enough of a "unique" flair to be memorable, but all the commands are still the same.

I also allow all the menusets sync has installed to be used by anyone. I'm all for customization. Let the user decide what they want, I'm not going to force my Bad ANSI on them.

It's not just about the ANSI.. You can change the commands to whatever you want too, if that suites you.

One thing I didn't like so much about some BBS menu sets is that if you're in one sub-menu, you often have to go back to the main menu to get to another sub-menu (such as going from the file transfer menu to the games menu, for instance). I wanted to have a menu structure where users could go from (pretty much) any sub-menu directly to any other sub-menu (basically requiring a set of global commands). I also have my message menu as a separate menu from the main screen. So my commands are a fair bit different from the stock Synchronet menu commands.

of them, but I love all the features Synchronet has. That's why the last time I set this back up (a few years ago), I briefly considered Mystic, along with another not-quite-finished BBS software written in nodejs called ENiGMA1/2, but I came right back to Synchronet because it has everything I wanted, and if I ever got bit by the bug, I could customize it (which I started doing over the last month).

Yeah, I like Synchronet for the features it has and ability to customize it.

Nightfox

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■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

El 8/1/19 a las 23:01, DaiTengu escribi≤:

support syncdraw please!

=)

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■ Synchronet ■ Dock Sud BBS TLD 24 HS - http://bbs.docksud.com.ar - telnet://bbs.docksud.com.ar

El 8/1/19 a las 23:01, DaiTengu escribi≤:

support syncdraw please!

=)

I've had trouble using syncdraw myself :9

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■ Synchronet ■ AlleyCat! BBS - http://alleycat.synchro.net:81

El 7/2/19 a las 13:38, Mortifis escribi≤:

support syncdraw please!

=)

I've had trouble using syncdraw myself :9

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lacks a bit of love for the source code...

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■ Synchronet ■ Dock Sud BBS TLD 24 HS - http://bbs.docksud.com.ar - telnet://bbs.docksud.com.ar