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    From Chai to All on Wed Nov 14 19:56:51 2018
    So, I'm a little late getting this info, but apparently Oracle is going to start charging for updates to the Java platform. I was just curious if any of you use Java at your jobs, and how this is affecting you.
  • From Jagossel@VERT/OUTWEST to Chai on Thu Nov 15 09:07:00 2018
    Chai, to All...

    So, I'm a little late getting this info, but apparently Oracle is going
    to start charging for updates to the Java platform. I was just curious
    if any of you use Java at your jobs, and how this is affecting you.

    Oracle seems to be heading down the wrong direction, if thst were the case. How is that going to work? You have to pay just to use the Java VM or pay
    to get the SDK? I would imagine the latter.

    For crying out loud, at least Microsoft went in the proper direction and has been working on opening up their .NET platorm by making their CLR and
    MSBUILD open source, and starting the .NET Core as an open source project. Among other things that Microsoft bas changed over the recent years after
    Bill Gates retired.

    The software vendor I work for does use Java for their portal software, and
    we use it combine and minify our JavaScript files for our front end. I
    would imagine that will hurt us, but probably not stop us. Hopefully, the
    open source implementation, OpenJDK, will fill in the gap.

    In my opinion, Oracle is going to shoot themselves in the foot by charging
    for their platform while Microsoft is opening up theirs.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Thu Nov 15 09:27:35 2018
    Re: Java
    By: Chai to All on Wed Nov 14 2018 07:56 pm

    So, I'm a little late getting this info, but apparently Oracle is going to start charging for updates to the Java platform. I was just curious if any of you use Java at your jobs, and how this is affecting you.

    Wat? I haven't heard of this. As someone else asked, I'm curious if that's for the runtime or if it's for the JDK.

    Nightfox

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  • From Jagossel@VERT/OUTWEST to Nightfox on Thu Nov 15 14:36:00 2018
    Nightfox, to Chai...

    Re: Java
    By: Chai to All on Wed Nov 14 2018 07:56 pm

    So, I'm a little late getting this info, but apparently Oracle is going to start charging for updates to the Java platform. I was just curious if any of you use Java at your jobs, and how this is affecting you.

    Wat? I haven't heard of this. As someone else asked, I'm curious if that's for the runtime or if it's for the JDK.

    It appears that this is all rumors at the moment. Here is the article that mentions it:

    https://www.businessinsider.com/oracle-starts-to-audit-java-customers-2016-12

    And here is the follow up article where Oracle denies it:

    https://www.businessinsider.com/oracle-says-it-is-not-ramping-up-a-audits-of-java-2016-12

    Still, considering that not all of the JRE is free is a terrible move to
    make; regardless if it is corporate or home users.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Jagossel on Thu Nov 15 12:30:46 2018
    Re: Re: Java
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Thu Nov 15 2018 02:36 pm

    Still, considering that not all of the JRE is free is a terrible move to make; regardless if it is corporate or home users.

    I'm wondering if this will affect Android app developers (since Android apps typically use Java) - though Android doesn't use the standard Java runtime..

    Nightfox

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  • From Minex@VERT/TDOD to Chai on Thu Nov 15 09:14:01 2018
    Re: Java
    By: Chai to All on Wed Nov 14 2018 07:56 pm

    So, I'm a little late getting this info, but apparently Oracle is going to start charging for updates to the Java platform. I was just curious if any of you use Java at your jobs, and how this is affecting you.

    My company is a Java shop. We use OpenJDK for this very reason.


    The Dawn of Demise BBS (tdod.org)

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  • From Chai to Nightfox on Thu Nov 15 15:38:00 2018
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    So, I'm a little late getting this info, but apparently Oracle is going to start charging for updates to the Java platform. I was just curious if any

    Wat? I haven't heard of this. As someone else asked, I'm curious if that's for the runtime or if it's for the JDK.

    I got the notification when I updated my Java VM. I do have the SDK
    nstalled.
    Personal licenses are still free until the year 2020. Business's will have
    to obtain a commercial license. I thought maybe at first, it might only
    apply to Java SE version 8, as that was what I had installed.
    But, I came across this:

    https://www.quora.com/Is-Oracle-going-to-charge-for-Java-from-2019

    and

    https://goo.gl/Ubz6Jq

    I've read that they will try to make the process for OpenJDK interchangeable,
    so companies can still go that route, lacking support and enterprise
    management tools.

    I'll do further research to see exactly what this implies.
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Jagossel on Thu Nov 15 17:53:31 2018
    Re: Re: Java
    By: Jagossel to Chai on Thu Nov 15 2018 09:07 am

    So, I'm a little late getting this info, but apparently Oracle is
    going to start charging for updates to the Java platform. I was just
    curious if any of you use Java at your jobs, and how this is affecting Ch>> you.

    Sounds like Java's dead and they want some sucker customers to pay for a license before it goes off into oblivion.

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  • From Chai to Jagossel on Thu Nov 15 22:56:00 2018
    Jagossel wrote to Chai <=-

    Oracle seems to be heading down the wrong direction, if thst were the case. How is that going to work? You have to pay just to use the Java
    VM or pay to get the SDK? I would imagine the latter.

    I've done some digging around. Updates to the Oracle version, support and
    enterprise tools will require a commercial license for non-personal use.
    However, they will be linking the builds with the OpenJDK, so that there
    is little to no technical difference. So, I suppose there is a roadmap
    for business' to simply use the OpenJDK version without support, if they
    want to avoid Oracle subscriptions. It only affects the Oracle JDK.

    For crying out loud, at least Microsoft went in the proper direction
    and has been working on opening up their .NET platorm by making their
    CLR and MSBUILD open source, and starting the .NET Core as an open
    source project. Among other things that Microsoft bas changed over the recent years after Bill Gates retired.

    That's what the communities are saying.

    The software vendor I work for does use Java for their portal software, and we use it combine and minify our JavaScript files for our front
    end. I would imagine that will hurt us, but probably not stop us. Hopefully, the open source implementation, OpenJDK, will fill in the
    gap.

    If they will be keeping the technologies in sync, it sounds like it should.


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  • From Chai to Jagossel on Thu Nov 15 23:20:00 2018
    Jagossel wrote to Nightfox <=-

    It appears that this is all rumors at the moment. Here is the article that mentions it:

    If it's all rumors, great. The notice I received came as part of an update from the Java updater. My understanding of Java licensing leaves something
    to be desired, however.

    I also found this..

    -------------------------------------
    InfoWorld
    -------------------------------------
    What happens if you donÆt renew

    If users do not renew a subscription, they lose rights to any commercial software downloaded during the subscription. Access to Oracle Premier Support also ends. Oracle recommends that those choosing not to renew transition to OpenJDK binaries from the company, offered under the GPL, before their subscription ends. Doing so will let users keep running applications uninterrupted.
    --------------------------------------
    Ref: https://goo.gl/vt6Yts


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  • From Chai to Nightfox on Fri Nov 16 01:19:41 2018
    Re: Re: Java
    By: Nightfox to Jagossel on Thu Nov 15 2018 12:30 pm

    I'm wondering if this will affect Android app developers (since Android apps typically use Java) - though Android doesn't use the standard Java runtime..

    From what I understand, it only affects the Oracle Java SDK. All of the other SDK providers are unaffected. So, depending on what variant Google is using, I'm guessing this will have little impact on them.

    Amazon even has a Java SDK, which I did not know. I'm learning, slowly.
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Nov 16 10:05:48 2018
    Re: Re: Java
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Jagossel on Thu Nov 15 2018 05:53 pm

    Sounds like Java's dead and they want some sucker customers to pay for a license before it goes off into oblivion.

    I thought I've heard Java is used in many different types of devices.. One major place Java is used is on Android phones & tablets - though it uses a different runtime other than the standard Java runtime. I suppose you wouldn't necessarily have to use Oracle's Java compiler for Android apps either.

    Nightfox

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  • From Jagossel@VERT/OUTWEST to Chai on Fri Nov 16 11:10:00 2018
    Chai, to Nightfox...

    I'm wondering if this will affect Android app developers (since Android apps typically use Java) - though Android doesn't use the standard Java runtime..

    From what I understand, it only affects the Oracle Java SDK. All of
    the other SDK providers are unaffected. So, depending on what variant Google is using, I'm guessing this will have little impact on them.

    Amazon even has a Java SDK, which I did not know. I'm learning,
    slowly.

    Having to look into this a little bit myself, I am not too worried about
    it. To me, it just looks like Oracle JRE SE will just have a different
    pricing model to it, and Oracle is just jumping onto that "subscription pricing model" bandwagon that Adobe and Microsoft Office has adopted.

    So, it seems like Oracle JRE SE will continue to be free for personal use; Oracle is now offering a different way to have a commercial license paid
    for (moving from a one-time payment to a per-user, per-month); and OpenJDK will continue to be free (both libre and gratis), if not, there will
    probably be a fork of OpenJDK that will be (like CentOS from RHEL).

    Still though, this just doesn't seem like a good business practice for the comsumers of Oracle JRE SE. It just comes across, to me, that Oracle is
    trying to collect some form of "royality fees".

    We'll see how this will turn out.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

    ... My monitor has two different grays of shade.
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  • From Deavmi@VERT/EWBBS to Chai on Sun Nov 18 11:55:14 2018
    Oracle dun fucked.

    +==========+

    Regards,
    Tristan B. Kildaire (Deavmi)

    Email: deavmi@ewbbs.synchro.net; deavmi@kk4qbn.synchro.net

    +==========+

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